Original Mount Vernon High School

Here is the information about the school that is written on a nearby roadside historical marker:

Original Mount Vernon High School:
The original Mount Vernon High School was located here on 8.8 acres that were once part of George Washington's Mount Vernon estate. Fairfax County purchased the land for $400 per acre in November 1938. Construction funding was provided by Fairfax County and the Depression-era Federal Public Works Administration. The school opened in January 1940 and continued here until 1973, when the new school opened nearby. Melvin B. Landes served as principal from 1945 to 1973 during a period of rapid population growth and integration. Former Virginia Governor and United States Senator Charles S. Robb is among the notable graduates.


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Here follows an excerpt from the Spring 2019 edition of the "Franconia Legacies" newsletter published by the Franconia Museum:

MARGARET ROGERS WELCH
Original Mount Vernon High School (OMVHS) Oral History Project for the Virginia Department of Transportation in February 2019.

Laura Purvis: February 21, 2018. This is Laura Purvis of Cultural Resource Analysts interviewing Margaret Rogers Welch at her home in Franconia, Virginia. She is one of the early graduates of the Original Mount Vernon High School.

Margaret Rogers Welch: My name is Margaret Ellen Rogers Welch, and I was at Mount Vernon High School from 1941 to 1944. We were the first full four-year class that went to Mount Vernon High School.

LP: So tell me a little bit about your earliest memories of the Original Mount Vernon High School and going there.

MRW: Well, it wasn’t completely finished when I went there. And, well, it was very exciting because we went, actually, from an elementary school in the seventh grade right in to high school. That was before Fairfax County had the eighth grade. And, it was exciting about changing classes, but there were so many things that we lacked. Like, we lacked a cafeteria. So, we bagged lunch and we ate in our homeroom. And then, we didn’t have a gym. So, for PE, we did tumbling in the halls on mats. We went outside, and we walked to Mount Vernon estate several times during the season on the back roads and through the woods. We did all kinds of things of things. We even pulled the weeds, because there was no lawn. I mean, it was so new. And so, our PE was sort of limited because we didn’t have a gym. And, our tumbling — we had to do it in between. We had to make sure the classes were going on when we spread the mats down the hall. And, sometimes, when they were running and doing tumblesaults, [sic] somebody would get off a mat and banging into a classroom door. [Rogers Welch laughs] It was just all kinds — it was all kinds of things — well we had a very innovative gym teacher who had us doing all kinds of things just to move the body, you know. So, that's what we took for gym. And, the whole time I was there, we still had no gym, no cafeteria.

LP: How has the high school then changed over time from when there was no cafeteria, there was no gym. Did you ever go back after it had kind of expanded and changed?

MRW: I never did. Isn't that funny? I never did go back to Mount Vernon. I got busy with other things, and I never did go back to the high school because it stayed like that for years. So, I have no idea what it looks like now, except from the outside.

LP: Well, you should come back sometime when you can. We can arrange that. So, tell me a little bit more, you know, just this image of you guys in the hallways doing somersaults and things like that for gym. It is just so wonderful. Tell me a little more about what an average day was like for you at the school.

MRW: Well, we had a homeroom. That's where we ate our lunch. And, well, we had our library time. We had a choir and music. And, but the halls, like I say, were very busy because there was always a gym class going on upstairs. And, the girl that worked in the office — that was before computers — she went bodily from room to room to get the attendance each day. So, she would come down the hall with her pad to go into the classroom to get the attendance and somebody would be doing a tumblesault and one or the other would have to give up. So, it wasn't exactly the idea situation that we had. There were lots of scraps and mishaps. But, it went on like that. I'm not sure of the year that they built the gym, but it was quite a few years. Well, Fairfax County didn't have any funds to add on to it. But, mostly everything was accomplished in your homeroom. Went back, you always went back to your homeroom for everything. So, that's where we gathered in the morning. That's where we ate our lunch — and, between that and the library.

LP: So you didn't eat lunch outside, it was always in your homeroom?

MRW: Well, unless we were going on a walking field trip and brought our lunch. Sometimes we'd go to Mount Vernon, we'd walk there, and we'd take our lunch. And, we'd do that. So, didn't think of it as fun things, because now we would. But, I mean, this was a chore. This was something that we were doing for gym. And you were getting graded on it. I mean, if you didn't show up that day, you know, you were absent. And, you know, it wasn't exactly a hop, skip, and a jump. It was like a good mile, I guess, or more, through the woods. And, so, we got to the point: Oh, going to Mount Vernon again, you know. [Rogers Welch laughs]

LP: So, did you ever go there for history, or anything, or was —

MRW: Oh, yeah! In elementary school, in the fourth grade, everybody goes to Mount Vernon as a field trip. And then, of course, I took my children there when they were growing up. I've been there many times to the restaurant. Oh, it's not even like the same place.

LP: What has changed? Like, what was that walk like when you were in high school? What do you remember it looking like?

MRW: I just remember going through fields and woods. And, it was like a path they had made. I would be more interested in talking and visiting with my peers than paying attention to what was around me, you know. Now, I would pay attention more to what was around me. But, that was a teenager's version.

LP: How many of you were there that would walk? Like, would it be just one class?

MRW: It would be a whole PE class. Maybe 30. Yeah. And, so, it was: Oh, Mount Vernon again. [Both laugh] We just liked the idea that we were out and about. But, George's home again? [Rogers Welch laughs] But, now buses are lined up all over the place to get in.

LP: So it wasn't crowded at that time? There weren't a lot of people —

MRW: Well, there were a lot of people, but nothing compared to what it is now. [Rogers Welch laughs] We didn't go there really to sight see Mount Vernon. We went for the gym part of it. And, we would go there and then we would turn around and walk back. Because, you know, you only had like fifty minutes or so for your class. But, anyway, it was a fun time really.

LP: What were your other classes like? Did you have the same class at the same time each day, or did it rotate?

MRW: Well in Fairfax County, in those days, you had an academic diploma, a commercial diploma, a vocational diploma, and an elective diploma. So, you made your choice. The people that knew they were going to college, when they went to first year high school, they all took academic. And, the people, like me, who knew they were going out in the business world and work; they took commercial. So, everything you took from a sophomore on was connected with business. And, your diploma, when you graduated, had on there commercial, academic, vocational, elective. Which now, they don't do that. So, that's the way it was. You could go right from graduation, taking a commercial course in Fairfax County in those days, and work right in a business — go right into a business. Because, you took bookkeeping. You took two years of typing, two years of shorthand, two years of bookkeeping, Business Math, Business English. So, you were — it was during the war. So, you were solicited from Fort Belvoir and the Cameron Quartermaster. People were coming after the seniors in the business class. They wanted them to come to work. So, I mean, there was no shortage of jobs in that respect. So, they don't do that, I think, now. I think it is one diploma. I don't know how it is. But, it wasn't distinguished like it was then.

LP: So, were then the vocational degrees oriented towards a trade school and then the — what was the elective?

MRW. The elective. That was just somebody that just slid through on the seat — [Rogers Welch laughs] the best they could. [Pauses and laughs]

LP: That's really interesting that there were four. I didn't know —

MRW: And they had, outside, they taught bricklaying. So the guys learned out to be bricklayers, carpenters, painters. Vocational. So they could go right into a job, you know.

LP: So were there people recruiting them as well? Or was that more for business track?

MRW: I think it was more for the business, really. Like Belvoir and Quartermaster during World War Two, because they were really busy. They had household goods coming in; people coming in. You know, military people coming and going all the time. And, they had recruits coming and going. So, they needed lots of people to work in those two places. So, they were recruiting the business.

LP: So, do you remember on the grounds where they were doing bricklaying, carpentry, and all of that?

MRW: Yeah, it was — they had a little house, I guess that little house is still there, kind of on the back by the side of the building. It was a bungalow.

LP: Was it the Home Economics?

MRW: They had —. It was like a furnished home. It was like a rambler home. It was where the girls — I didn't take Home Ec, unfortunately. I was sorry that I didn't take the Home Ec. But, I couldn't fit it in with all the other subjects. But, the girls would go down there and they learned. They had a home. They had a kitchen, bath, bedroom, everything. And they learned everything about taking care of a home — childcare. I don't know if that home is still here. It was on the grounds.

MRW: I know there were people in baseball and sports and football. And, the girls would be doing basketball and tumbling. We had one girl that she should have been a gymnast. That was before that was real popular. And, she could get to the end of the hall and start running and by the time she got — we'd have like three long mats — and she would do flips and then land on her hands and do tumblesaults on the mats all the way to the end. She was great. Yeah. I was afraid she was going to crack her head open if she missed that mat, you know. But, you know she was really good. She could stand, you know, on one hand. Balance her whole body, you know. So the rest of us would watch. [Both laugh] Because, nobody could compete with her [Pause]

LP: So, in addition to the students that you talked to and had amazing gymnastic abilities, were there other people that you remember interacting with a lot — either faculty or students, or people that were really part of that experience being at Mount Vernon?

MRW: Well, my shorthand teacher, Ms. Molly Lehrman. I've got to get my yearbook out. I remember she signed it. She said how many words a minute I could do shorthand. She was a character. [Both laugh] She had dark auburn hair. And, she would sit on her desk, and she would do most of her teaching that way. Sitting at her desk. And, she was very dramatic, very dramatic. And then, my typing teacher was the opposite. There wasn't any drama. And she carried the ruler. And, if you looked at your keys — well, they were supposed to be covered — but if they weren't and you looked — wham. And she took the ruler and smacked your hands. But, you learned from her. You were scared to death. [Both laugh] But, they were the opposite. They were both in the commercial department. One taught shorthand, and one taught typing. And, you learned. I learned more from the typing teacher because the other one was so dramatic. [Both laugh and pause] And so, but, anyway. I realized when I went to work for the government, and the supervisor — there were two of us that went at the same time. And, the supervisor said: Well, which one is the steno? Which one knows shorthand. And I reluctantly said, "I do." Because I knew I had the glamorous teacher, the drama teacher for the shorthand. And I thought, oh golly. And, I didn't really want to go with steno. But, anyway, that's what I did. I went for the government before even graduating from high school as a stenographer. And, I wished I had the other teacher so many times. [Both laugh] But, I made out okay. I did fine with the typing. But, a few of the things that I had to transcribe, I said, "No, that's not right, that doesn't make any sense. But, I can't read my own shorthand." But, anyway, it turned out okay. Shorthand wasn't easy. It was like learning a foreign language, you know. It was Pitman and Gregg, two different kinds of shorthand. And so, she was teaching us Gregg. And, the lady that I was working for in the government used Pitman's shorthand. So, she would have all of her notes in her shorthand, and I would have all of my notes in mine. And, we couldn't compare them because they were two different kinds

LP: Oh no.

MRW: So, I didn't know about the other kind of shorthand until I went to work. And, she was an older lady and she had learned it. But, anyway, I'm glad that I did. I learned a whole lot, you know.

LP: What was life like being a student there? Were there places that you would hang out near the school. How would you get to school each day? You know, those kind of things.

MRW: Well, we rode the school bus. And, I was kind of a nerd, I guess. I was more studious. I was afraid to do things that would cause you to go to the Principal’s Office, or devilish things. I would do devilish things now, but I wouldn't do devilish things then. [Pauses and laughs] Because, my mother and father were — my mother didn't drive. And my father said, Well, if you have any trouble with the teachers, you're going to have some trouble with your father when you come home. He said, “You got to go to school. You got to learn, and you respect your teachers.” So I was kind of, you know—. And, I did all of my homework. I did everything that I was supposed to do. I didn't go in back of the shop and smoke cigarettes, and skip school, and those kinds of things. Because, to me, you were just going to get in trouble. But, I had three or four close girlfriends and we managed okay. But, none of us were what you call devilish. There were a few. But, that was a time when they didn't take any stuff off of you. I mean, a couple of times in the Principal's Office, and they kicked you out. And you knew that. So, you know, you straightened up and flew right. You didn't fool around. You wanted to graduate. You wanted to have good grades. You wanted to be able to get a good job. So, that's what most people in the commercial, the ones that took the commercial course, they were more serious minded. But, the ones that took the elective, they were the rascals. That wasn't saying that they weren't smart.

LP: So, where would people gather or hang out?

MRW: Well, we didn't have any places. Because we didn't have any other buildings, other than that Home Ec cottage. They would go down in the back behind the school. Oh, there was always guys smoking, you know, in between classes or something. They would get expelled. I know there was one guy kissing a girl behind the, in the science lab, behind the door when the bell rang. Now, this was in between classes. And, a teacher caught them. The parents had to come in. They were taken off the school bus. They could not ride. They could go to school, but they could not ride the Fairfax County school bus for three weeks. Can you see them doing that today? Parents would really be up in arms. The parents, I think, then, were — they had more respect for what the teachers had to do. And they sort of went along with, to an extent, they went along with things. Times have changed.

LP: Yes, ma'am. Yeah. So, while you were at the school, was it, did it ever feel crowded, was it busy? What did it feel like inside of the building to you?

MRW: Well, it was, everybody was always in a rush when the bell rang going from class to class, you know. You didn't have many people — probably today they stop and talk at their lockers or do something. There wasn't much of that. You didn't want to be late. So there wasn't any places. Like I say, I was a Ms. Goodie-two shoes. I tried to be on time and not to be late. And to do things that the law said you were supposed to do [Both laugh] I wasn't the devilish type. But, I wouldn't say that I wouldn't have turned into one later on. But, when I was in school, I wasn't.

LP: So, were there lockers?

MRW: Yeah, there were lockers. But, anyway. There was more respect shown for teachers. You never called a teacher by their first name. Never thought of that. They were always Ms. or Mr. so-and-so. It was just a given. I just think that there were a lot of parents 25-35 in those days that weren't working, were staying home. Maybe they had more time to spend teaching their kids manners and respect for the teachers. Because, I never saw any kid ever, ever, ever be rude to a teacher.

LP: So, you mentioned that you were working even before you left school. How was that?

MRW: They recruited. This was during the war. They would send out recruits from Fort Belvoir and Cameron Quartermaster Depot, and they were mostly to the commercial students. And, they offered you Saturday jobs if you knew typing, bookkeeping, or filing, or shorthand. Oh, there were lots and lots of girls that went to Belvoir and Quartermaster. And, then you had the opportunity that you could take —. After you graduated, you could take the permanent—. [Pause] What was that test called? It was a government test that everybody had to take if you wanted to work for the government. Well, it is on the tip of my tongue, and I can't think of it. But anyway, it was a very serious test because it was a matter of whether you got permanent status or if you were a temporary person. And, of course, in those days everybody wanted to get permanent status. And, the tests were something like on a Saturday and you had to show up at eight o'clock in the morning. I think they went on until about two or three in the afternoon. And, you were locked in a room with a person who was giving the test with her time watch, and you were scared to death. Oh, people were fainting. They were getting nauseated and sick because you couldn't leave the room. And, I prayed and prayed. I took all my jewelry off. Anything that would detract me from the test. It was a lot of written test, a lot of questions. And, you had to have an eighty or above to pass. And, if you passed, you got permanent status with the government. But, you had the opportunity to re-take the test. But, anything below that, you didn't pass. So, I passed by the skin of my teeth the first time I took it. But, I know people that took it like three times.

LP: Right. So, pretty much everyone that you knew in the school that was in your classes, and all of that, their goal was to work for the government?

MRW: Either that or the ones that were going to be professionals. You know, doctors, lawyers, teachers. The ones who took the academic course. Did you ever hear of Judge Bostetter? Martin Van Buren Bostetter was the bankruptcy judge for the eastern part of the state of Virginia in Alexandria. Of course, he's passed now. He was in my graduating class. Martin Van Buren Bostetter Junior. And, at the baccalaureate service and graduation service, we had it in the Reed Theater, because of course we didn't have any gym, auditorium. My mother said, That boy should be a lawyer. Well, that boy became a judge. [Rogers Welch laughs] So our claim to fame was him. When we — Oh, well, we were in the class with Martin Van Buren. [Both laugh] But anyway, he went to UVA, and got his law degree. And, so, we had gals that went to nursing school. They first got their degree, and then they taught nursing after they got their degree. And, then we had, you know, ones that wanted to be teachers. So everybody that wanted to go into that profession took the academic course. So now, none of them typed. None of them did shorthand. So, they would come to us to type up something for them. [Both laugh]

LP: Really?

MRW: Yeah. It was funny.

LP: Did you ever get any side money off of that?

MRW: No, I didn't. Not when I was going to school. But, I got some side money when I was, not working for the government, but, I was working for another firm. I did some typing for this guy that was getting a degree.

LP: Nice. [Both laugh] So, you mention that you had your graduation at the Reed Theater in Alexandria. So, there weren't any — there wasn't a gym, there wasn't a cafeteria, there weren't any big spaces at the school. So, what was the interior of it like? I mean, what was the light like? What did it feel like being inside the school? Was the tile there at the time?

MRW: Oh yeah, the school was completed. What we had was completely finished. It wasn't like raw cinder blocks. We had finished rooms. We just didn't have enough of them. We had no cafeteria, and we had no shop. No gym. No, well, we did have a library. But, we had to use our homeroom as our lunch room. I remember this one gal that was so young when she graduated, she was like sixteen and was going to go to work at Belvoir. But she had to be 18 to go. And so, she came back and worked in the school office until she was eighteen, and then she went to work at Belvoir. And she had taken the commercial course. So, she was all ready to go into Belvoir. But, we had — the classrooms that we had were all finished, you know. They weren't parts of things that weren't finished. We didn't have any computers, of course. We had a mimeograph machine, you know. We had general business, bookkeeping, all these were commercial classes: general business, bookkeeping, business English, business math, shorthand one and two, and typing one and two. So, when you finished with all of those courses, you could go work in an office. You were, you know, qualified.

LP: So, the steps that are out in front of the school now, were they there? All of that landscaping and stuff?

MRW: Yes, in fact, I don't know where that picture is. We've got a picture of our class of '44 sitting on those steps. But see, we had no sidewalks, no grass. It was all in the rough, you know. Because the school was new and they hadn't seeded. Had no lawn. And lots of times for PE we pulled weeds. We did all kinds of things.

LP: Some people have talked about pulling rocks out as, like, that was a version of punishment. Like, if you did something you weren't supposed to, they would have you get rocks out of the back area.

MRW: Well, some of the men PE teachers, I'm sure, did that because, I'm sure, there were plenty rascals. [Both laugh] So, they had their hands full. I didn't — we didn't — do any of that. Our PE teacher, Mrs. Hansborough, she was big in this tumbling. Standing on your head, walking on your hands. You know.

LP: So were students, what were students doing outside studying and classes? Were there dances? You mention sports a little bit. Were there other activities?

MRW: Well, we had dances every now and then, but they didn't have them —. You know, I lived too far away from the school. And, like I said, I was a Ms. Goodie-two-shoes, so I didn't get involved into anything. Like, a bunch of kids would get into a car and go off to some place and get a hamburger or a Coke or something. I just didn't any of that. And, there was a place in Alexandria called, I think it was called, the Little Tower or something. And, they had these little small hamburgers, and the kids would, you know, go in there and get a coke and a hamburger. Because there weren't too many places in those days for you to—, not like Number One is now every other place is somewhere to get something to eat. We did have a nice barbecue place. But, it was just a different atmosphere then. It was the war, and the guys were quitting schools. Dropping out of school like flies. Joining the Army. Joining the Marines. Joining the Navy. And so, it was a totally different atmosphere in those years.

LP: So, did rationing affect the school at all?

MRW: We had rationing. I don't recall how much it affected the school. I guess maybe sugar, probably. Then, you dressed up, especially if you were a senior. You wore hose and heels to high school. Who does that now? [Both laugh]

LP: I read where there were even times that they weren't able to get access to hose. But, you guys always had access to hose?

MRW: Yeah. We would use fingernail polish to stop a run. Oh, everything was rationed. But, you know, you just grew up with it and didn't think about it. Didn't even give it a thought. But, it was during the war and, like I said, the guys that were juniors and seniors and at least seventeen — so many of them were joining up. And then, they finished, they got their diplomas after service. A lot of them finished up like that. So, it was a time when everybody was very patriotic, extremely patriotic. You were doing everything you could do to help the boys. Knitting and making all kinds of things.

LP: Were there efforts at school for knitting different things and doing different projects, or was that mostly in the community?

MRW: You know there may have been, but I can't recall a whole lot of things going on in that respect. I'm sure there must have been things. But, I just remember mainly the boys that quit school and joined. And then we had a couple of girls who said, Well they weren't going to quit, they were going on to get their degree, but they were going overseas. They got their degree in nursing and that they were going to go overseas as soon as they go out of school after they got the degree. So, it was just a different atmosphere then. Everything was different. Everyone was so patriotic. But then you have all of these marches and things going on. And nobody was divided up with this that and the other. Everybody was together for one cause.

LP: So did you attend football games?

MRW: I attended a few football games. But, see, there again, it was a matter of transportation. I wasn't a real big sports person. I didn't even understand football. But, you had to — the football games would be later than your bus, so you would have to stay afterwards.

LP: So would your dad then come pick you up, or would you get a ride with friends the times that you did go?

MRW: There were a lot of good athletes, you know. A lot of good girls that played basketball.

LP: Do you know where they would practice?

MRW: They didn't have any place to practice, except in the halls as far as I know because we had no gym. I think they got a gym sooner than they got anything else down there. [Pause] We didn't think anything of it going from the seventh grade in elementary school to the first year of high school. I mean, we were over-whelmed. And the fact that we didn't have a gym, it wasn't that big a deal. We didn't have a gym in elementary school, you know. [Both laugh]

LP: What is one thing that you hope people will remember about the high school? If you could tell people in the future one thing that you hope they remember about the school?

MRW: I think that we took pride in the school. As I remember, I don't think, I don't recall vandalism. I mean you were afraid. If you did anything like that, a letter was going straight home to your parents. And your parents were either coming straight there and shelling out the money to pay for it, or you wouldn't be able to go back to school for a while. Things were much, much stricter. Yeah. So, that's the part that I remember. I was afraid to be bad. [Both laugh] But, that was when I was young and naive.

LP: Yeah, yeah. That makes sense.

MRW: But I mean, oh there was plenty rascality [sic] going on because there were plenty of rascals around, you know. [Both laugh]

LP: I think that's one thing that doesn't change.

MRW: No, no. And some of those rascals turned out to be some of the smartest people around.

LP: Right, yeah. True. True. Well, is there anything else you would like to talk about? Anything that we haven't gone over so far?

MRW: I was just trying to think. [Pause] I'm glad that they are preserving the school — that they are not going to tear it down. Because, it was—. I went there from 1941 to 1944. My class was the first class that went all four years. So, it was our high school. It wasn't like we had Lee Jackson and Mount Vernon, or Fairfax and Mount Vernon. I just think it has a certain historical value since it is close to George Washington's home. And, it's got the name Mount Vernon. I just like to see the building preserved. I enjoyed my time there. I really did. I looked forward to going to school. In fact, I hated when I had to miss And, I didn't know that I had an admirer in my class until I went to my first ten-year reunion. And, I saw this person. We were both married by then. He told me that he used to — he said, Don't you remember me riding my bike up and down Beulah Street? He said, That was when it was Beulah Road. I said, "Well, I didn't pay any attention to that." He said, I rode my bicycle up there just so I could see you. So, I said, "Oh, well I didn't realize that. I'm sorry." [Both laugh]

LP: So, is there anything else you'd like to talk about?

MRW: Well, one thing that I enjoyed was when we had our class rings. I don't know if they still get class rings or not.

LP: Yeah, they do. Yes, ma'am.

MRW: I got — what is the purple stone — is it amethyst? It is an amethyst I guess. It wasn't my birthstone, but it was my father's birthstone. But, it was pretty — lavender.

LP: Oh, okay.

MRW: And, got the green gold with the lavender stone. I didn't have the crest on it. And, everybody took pride in their rings. and, of course, mine unfortunately got lost over the years. But, I know it was a big, big thing when you got to do your pictures and you ordered your ring, you know, and your cap and gown. I just, people were just very serious about it, especially the rings. I enjoyed my four years there. The fact that we didn't have a gym, or a cafeteria, or anything, well, didn't have it, so how could we miss something?

LP: Yeah, didn't even think about it. Yeah.

MRW: The one thing I didn't have an opportunity to take because I took all commercial, was Home Ec. And, so after I got out of high school and went to work, I took a sewing class. I said, "I want to learn how to sew to make clothes." And so, I did. Other girls I knew took it in high school and learned how to do a lot of things. But anyway, it was a war time thing, the whole time we were in high school. The guys were very patriotic. Most of them all finished their education while they were in the service. Some of them didn't make it. The girls were getting married and hiding it, because in Fairfax County you could not go to school if you were married.

LP: Oh really?

MRW: No. What this one gal did, she had her wedding band in her pocket. She had gotten married. And, as soon as she got her diploma, and they shook her hand with the diploma and she was walking across the stage, she took her ring band out and slipped it on her finger. So, by the time she got to the end of the stage, she had her wedding band on. But no, if they found out that you were married, you were out.

LP: Just a different time.

MRW: A different time, yeah. But, I enjoyed it. I really did. I had all good teachers. And, like I say, my father had said, Well if you come home with any bad things, or I hear of any bad things, you are going to get bad at home too. I will hear you out first. So, I made sure he didn't hear anything bad. But, it was lots of things going on then, just like it is now. Not as prevalent as you see.

LP: Well, I mean, it's wartime and there's all the pressures of that.

MRW: Yeah, kids are going to be kids. And they were sneaking cigarettes and smoking around behind, then they would catch them and send them home on a suspension. And my cousin, we lived together. My mother raised him. Anyway, he had a girlfriend when, I think, he was a junior, in the science lab. And between classes one time they met, and they were smooching behind the door to the science lab. And, they got suspended. For three days, they couldn't ride the school bus. I mean, they weren't doing anything. But, that was a no-no. So, anyways, is this going to be put out in some type of a book?

LP: Yes, yes it will be. We're going to have a website. We'll also have some printed materials and things.

MRW: There aren't many of us that went to Old Mount Vernon in the '40s that are around anymore I don't imagine.

LP: Yeah. I have spoken with you and Joe Alexander.

MRW: Yeah. Joe was a couple years, two or three years younger than I.

LP: Yes. He was '47 I think.

MRW: And James Rice, he's still living. He was an attorney, but he's retired. That was Martin Van Buren Bostetter, Jr.'s half-brother. And, where Martin went on to be a judge in my class, James, he would have been about eight or nine years younger when he went to Mount Vernon, and he was — he's retired now from being an attorney in Alexandria. I'm trying to think. And we had one gal, her name was Amelita Ward. Her father was a talent scout, and they lived on Valley View Drive in Franconia. And, he had a radio station. And his daughter, she really was a pretty girl. She looked like Hedy Lamar — I don't know if you know Hedy Lamar the movie star years ago.

LP: Yes, ma'am.

MRW: She's really pretty. And Amelita Ward resembled her. And she played it up, and she went to Lee Jackson. I don't think she went to Mount Vernon. But anyway, she was, she could sing. And she went on to make some movies — they were B rated moves with, I think the Three Stooges [Bowery Boys]. But it was fun because by her dad being in the business, he got her into it. And she went on to Hollywood, and she made B-rated movies. She never became famous. But, we thought it was great. We'd say, Oh look, there's Amelita. Look at Amelita. She really was a pretty girl, and, she looked so much like Hedy Lamar, the movie star. But anyway, it was a fun time. It really was. It was during the war, and I had two cousins and we would harmonize. I said, we thought we were the Andrews Sisters. [Both laugh] We would sit on the front porch and harmonize. And, just about all the guys were enlisting in the service of some kind. And, no matter where you went, there were just a whole bunch of soldiers. You know, you went to the beach, there they were, everywhere. So, everybody was just so patriotic in World War Two. It was just so different.

LP: Yeah, it seems like it was a very different way of thinking about — or it was just experiencing

MRW: Well, we hadn't had anything like that. It was just so new to us, you know. And the rationing of the sugar and the nylons. Anyway, my mother would go to the grocery store and she'd say, and she'd say, Now you get me a five pound bag of sugar. And I said, "Well, what about your five-pound bag of sugar?" And she says, "Well, I'm allowed so many coupons a month. And that will be what I have for the month." But I remember that rationing business, you know.

LP: So you would receive coupons and go redeem them, basically?

MRW: Yeah. And when your coupon was gone, you had to wait until the next time.

LP: Right, right.

MRW: We never had any problem because my mother was a very innovative lady. She knew how to make something out of nothing.

LP: Right, right.

MRW: So, it wasn't any different than it had always been with us. She would take a winter coat of hers, and, I remember, she made me a coat, and hat from that. This was when I was four years old, or five years old. She turned the coat inside out and made the coat, the outside, from the lining. The coat had a, well a self-lining. And, it was in perfect condition. And, she cut out a coat for me when I was little. And a hat that matched. She did her dresses like that. She would take the skirts of her dresses, and she'd make her own pattern. And, she'd make me dresses. In those days, little girls had dresses with, what we would call it, bloomers. And, when I came here from the third grade in Alexandria to Fairfax County, I had little dresses with bloomers. Well, where did that girl come from? What planet did she come from with her bloomers? [Both laugh]

LP: Oh gosh. That wasn't a thing out here?

MRW: Apparently not, and I soon found it out. But, they were made from my mother's dresses. And, the bloomers had elastic with like a little ruffle that would show just below your dress. They made a cute little outfit. But nobody in the third grade here had any, and I went home and I said, "I'm not wearing my bloomer dress anymore." [Rogers Welch laughs] But anyway, Fairfax County Schools, when I came here from Alexandria, was ahead of what I was doing in the same grade in Alexandria.

LP: Really?

MRW: Yeah. It took me a couple of weeks. They were doing multiplication in the third grade, and I had not had it in the third grade in Alexandria. So, I had to catch up. But, anyway, they were nice. They were good times. I wouldn't want to repeat them. [Both laugh] I wouldn't be able to.

[END OF INTERVIEW]